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Talk:Super Saiyan Full Power
Merging with Super Saiyan Hello? Anyone there? It's an empty talk page, so I don't know if anyone is watching this or will read this, but can we merge the Full-Power Super Saiyan article with the Super Saiyan article, as a sub-article or something? Giving it its own article causes many to believe it to be a Fourth Grade or something and causes confusion. An example would be at the Talk:Super Saiyan 2 article where I think a whole section was devoted to discussing this fact. No one's gonna read this, are they? (Sigh), guess I'll post at the Super Saiyan talkpage. --[[User:Dranzer Neos|'N'e'o's']] 17:08, 15 December 2008 (UTC) :Well there is already links In the Super Sayain page linking to this. IMO it would be better for having separate articles for SS and FPSS as they are quite diff from each other-- 17:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC) ::Yes, but there are links to all the SSj forms in Super Saiyan. What I wanted to say was to make a different section, like the 'Usage and Power' section in Super Saiyan, for the FPSSj. Its not different, its the same Level ''and Grade; its just a Mastered form of the original. Once again, it being there with all the other forms would make someone new to the fandom mistake it for a Fourth Grade. I should know, I mistook it as a Fourth Grade myself when I was a new fan, and was ready to argue my life over it, XD. --[[User:Dranzer Neos|'''Ne'o's']] 17:48, 15 December 2008 (UTC) :::The article's lead insists that Full-Power Super Saiyan is "not actually an advanced form of Super Saiyan, but rather a state of mental and physical perfection of the Super Saiyan transformation itself." I don't really stand anywhere with the issue of whether the article should be merged or not, I just mean to say that by reading the first sentence of the article, visitors should already not be under the impression that FPSS is the fourth grade of Super Saiyan. Storm 17:56, 15 December 2008 (UTC) ::::Yes, but they don't. Most people don't usually completely read articles while paying attention. They just read the original Super Saiyan article, read the 'Pre and Advanced Levels' section, think they know everything, and leave. OR, even if they do read related articles, most just skim through 'em. Or... maybe we could just put a small summary, while making the FPSSj article the main one? --[[User:Dranzer Neos|'Ne'o's']] 18:18, 15 December 2008 (UTC) I actually don't understand what you have in mind-- 18:32, 15 December 2008 (UTC) :It shouldn't be the problem of the editors that people don't use informative articles properly. Do you have an actually demographic that confirms most people don't visit this article? Like any other article on the wiki, if someone has questions about what exactly a FPSS is, it's as easy as clicking the article link, and by the end of the first sentence that question is answered. I think it's fair to assume that most people begin reading an article with its lead anyways. It's the same situation as Ascended Super Saiyan and Ultra Super Saiyan; most people know them by the names Super Saiyan Second and Third grade respectively, so being unfamiliar with these names, readers might look to these articles for an explanation of what these forms are, where they would find the lead gives the answer in short. It just seems ironic to me that the wiki's contributors should take into consideration that people ''won't be paying attention to random content in the article. There are links to the more technical forms' articles, so with these supplied in the article, let the readers be the judge of whether they want to continue reading or not. That's my opinion, but I think it sums up some of the principles of wikis pretty well. Storm 18:50, 15 December 2008 (UTC) :Okay I get what you mean. I thought that the article already provided summaries for the other Super Saiyan transformations. I've gone through the section and added summaries for all the entries though. That should clear up the confusion over the "fourth" SS grade. Storm 19:05, 15 December 2008 (UTC) ::Thanks, Storm. That's exactly what I had in mind. --[[User:Dranzer Neos|'''Ne'o's']] 19:22, 15 December 2008 (UTC) :::I would much rather have the Ultra and Ascended Super Saiyan articles merged into one. '-- bulletproof 08:02, 16 December 2008 (UTC) :::::Discussion continued at Talk:Ascended Super Saiyan so why not to stay in that form all the time? i didn't get that.. Because the forms not to stop form draining energy its too slow it down, eventually overtime you would have to power down. ^ Later in the series, the Elder Kaioshin says that if Goku and Vegeta fused while Super Saiyans, the resulting fighter would be massively powerful but have a shortened lifespan due to the strain of being trapped as a SSJ forever and unable to power down. So I think that even if you master the form it's still very stressful on the body. Goku and Gohan probably never intended their training as SSJ to go on forever. Just long enough to defeat Cell. This is possibly also the reason they didn't use the ROSAT a second time. Power Difference I have always thought that the Full Power Super Saiyan state never increased the power of the super saiyan state but kept the same power level as the orignal form but it just makes the user calmer. :Well, you have to take into account that Goku and Gohan when maximally powered in this state and after one year in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber were at least 1,5x (possibly more) as strong as Vegeta and Trunks after two years in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber and in Ascended Super Saiyan. I find it hard to believe that such a power difference only stemmed from Goku and Gohan's superior Base powers, because, as talented as they are, they would most likely be overtaken by Vegeta and Trunks in another year of training... so if you're stronger in Full Power Super Saiyan than someone other in Ascended, and presumably as strong as they would be in Ultra, then it means that either you advance like 5 times as fast as them in power via training, or that Full-Power Super Saiyan is indeed much more powerful than an unmastered variant. A Full-Power Super Saiyan's body has become so comfortable with the form that his muscles don't swell when he powers up, as shown with Goku powering up to the max after his warmup against Perfect Cell - there is no longer any possibility to "force" yourself into Ascended or Ultra, as your body can just take all the power you can put forth without any strain. Xfing 12:13, December 30, 2010 (UTC) Full-power Super Saiyan 4 Is their a possibilty of a Full-power Super Saiyan 4? :Actually, it does happen in the GT series. However, it doesn't have the same effects as "Full-Power Super Saiyan" has on the base Super Saiyan form. A "Full-Power Super Saiyan 4" is literally a Super Saiyan 4 with the Saiyan's energy at its maximum levels possible or in other words, a fully charged Super Saiyan 4. 00:31, July 28, 2010 (UTC) It's not a different form, he just had as much power as he could currently handle. This is not necessarily the most power that the form could handle if Goku were to, say, train for a year trying to maintain the form for as long as possible. 23:58, September 15, 2010 (UTC) Shorter I have not been on this page for a while I was woundering why did you make it shrter becuase before it was way longer : 22:55, September 15, 2010 (UTC) This page needs major editting ````Yoyepo This whole page is terribly inaccurate. terribly inaccurate. 1.) first of all, fpssj is no designated by very lightly colored yellow hair. This is what ssj looks like in general, watch the frieza fight. 2.) Yamu was not killed by Goku as a fpssj. He was killed by Yamu as a ssj2. Once again blatantly inaccurate. This is where Vegeta gets the idea to go majin, because goku's ssj2 he saw was stronger than his own, in fact in the manga Vegeta literally says "so kakarot can go ssj2 as well" directly following this scene. When I tried to edit this, I wasn't allowed. so somebody please change this terrible inaccuracy. 3.) in the article u act as if goku was more of a challenge for cell, and gohan cell was only beating gohan because gohan was not at full power, holding back for his gentle nature. Inaccurate. Gohan was fighting at funn power, in fact Cell couldn't hit him at first. Gohan' however, wasn't attacking cell, which to cell is boring. SO HE INCREASED HIS SPEED, allowing him to wail on fpssj gohan. after gohan tells his story, cell obviously increases his power level again so he can wail on Gohan and torture him w/o resistance. 4.) Gohan did not use this as the basis of transformation in buu. Gohan only went ssj2 in buu saga after seeing videl get beaten because his powers were awakened watching her. He was lierally about to go ssj2 on the sidelines. u can't argue he was calmed, he was calmed during the cell saga b4 cell returned. Gohan was clearly depicted as a fpssj in his fight against dabura, not ssj2, he even says b4 buu that he can't be like he used to be as a kid, and vegeta implies his ssj2 MIGHT be stronger than gohan's ssj2, so his goku didn't know vegeta could go ssj2 till majin, y did goku think ssj vegeta could do better against dabura? y? cuz gohan was also fpssj. 5.) The first Broly movie is not supposed to be in the ten days b4 cell. Gohan is in android saga clothes and looks half his cell age, trunks is capsule corp clothes and scrawny, piccolo is around ssj strength, gohan and goku should b ssjs all the time if this is b4 cell, yet they rn't, they r said to be taking a break from fighting the androids, plural, not from fighting cell, it's clearly of it's own timeline and is not after rosat, therefore Broly only defeated normal ssjs. This was clearly Toei's intent, backed up in their video games because super vegeta says to Broly "it's been a long time lssj", implying this happened b4 rosat. Gohan is two bangs normal ssj . he is one bang in fpssj. We saw that in buu saga, found many times in the manga. DBZ wiki, stop ignoring facts while embracing brolytards SUGGESTIVE theories that can't be proven true :Please sign your posts. In terms of these issues, I have told you before, we use the anime, and the form descriptions are accurate. 10:36, February 2, 2011 (UTC) It's not accurate no, it's. not accurate. Your article claims fpssj is designated by lightly colored yellow hair, but that's what super saiyan looks like in general, unless u actually believe goku was fpssj against frieza. Goku WAS ssj2 against yamu in the anime. you claim that Gohan was a ssj2 vs Dabura as fact, even though evidence in the anime, such as him shocked to find his father and vegeta fighting at ssj2, and how in the anime he says he can't be like he used to b, plus them clearly showing sparks at his ssj2 at the tourney all point toward him being fpssj. And there's no evidence he was ssj2, this is suggestive and ur article claims it as fact. once again, there's no proof they were fpssj against Broly in the first movie, if they were they would have started at base ssj, not normal saiyan, as it would be after rosat. so ur article is once again claiming an opinion as fact, when all the evidence points to the contrary. and once again, ur article claims Cell beat gohan because gohan held back, but gohan was in fact stronger than goku in the anime too, cell had to increase his speed to catch gohan. suggestive fanknowledge is kept, yet my fact is taken out. doesn't seem fair. ```` Yoyepo, February 2, 2011 :I'm sorry but the consensus is to use what guides describe and what the anime displays. 04:20, February 3, 2011 (UTC) not in any guide the anime displays goku in ssj2 vs yamu. the movie broly displays gohan not only not ssj base, as in after rosat, but in android saga clothes. clearly not fpssj. The anime displays Cell saying "you're fast aren't you. Let's kick it up a notch" implying the speed boost. Nowhere does the anime imply that fpssj is designated by light yellow hair, that's always been what ssj looks like b4 the character powers up. Nowhere does it diplay or say that gohan and goku were fpssj in broly, that goku was fpssj against yamu, or the hair thing. This is all wrong. It's literally all made up. If u can find me one scene in Broly where they say they r fpssj, I'll admit I'm wrong. If u can find any proof that goku was fpssj when he made yamu explode, I'll admit I'm wrong. and with the cell thing, I'm adding knowledge straight from the cell saga anime. And if u can find one scene where they say fpssj has lighter colored hair all the time, I'll admit I'm wrong. But I know u won't, cuz there is no proof. fpssj looks exactly like ssj because it is ssj, the only difference is because he gets it down from being ssj all the time, it's effortless, allowing him to raise his pl to levels he previously couldn't. It doesn't look different, once again completely made up to try to make Broly goku look as if he's fpssj, which he clearly isn't ````Yoyepo Feb 3, 2011 :The difference is first noted by Vegeta after Goku and Gohan exit the hyperbolic time chamber. Their transformations at this part of different than Vegeta's and Trunks', which is due to the attainment of the Full Power Super Saiyan form. 06:22, February 3, 2011 (UTC) I know yea, I know. The difference is that while they r super saiyan, they seem calm, it is now basically their base state. The white hair = fpssj is not true. It's just a difference in pl and ki control. Also, ur dodging the other issues I brought up that need to be changed ```` Yoyepo, February 3, 2011 :I'm having trouble deciphering some of your messages, perhaps the communication would be clearer if you brought up the issues one at a time. 07:57, February 3, 2011 (UTC) already done read my this page needs editting post. I make it clear as day light what changes I made that needed to be made that you guys took down, listed in order by number one at a time. ````Yoyepo, Feb 3, 2011 :1. Yes, it is, this is shown in the anime and pointed out by Vegeta. The hair color is noticeably lighter than SS, SS2, or SS3, and easily distinguishable from them. :2. The hair color makes it clear. :3. That is your opinion, this site is based on facts and official statements. :4. Gohan didn't use what? Your question is not decipherable. :5. Goku and Gohan are both alive and Super Saiyan, and the movie even says when it takes place. There is no alternative. 18:11, February 3, 2011 (UTC)